Author Topic: PSA: All Ragdolls are Blue Eyed, Pointed Cats  (Read 2290 times)

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Offline Desi

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PSA: All Ragdolls are Blue Eyed, Pointed Cats
« on: June 21, 2018, 01:19:13 am »
If someone is attempting to sell you a cat that is not Blue Eyed and Pointed, the cat or kitten they're offering you is not a Ragdoll. Mink, Solid, and Sepia colored cats are unaccepted variants and are not considered Ragdolls by the RFCI. Marketing these cats as Ragdolls is misrepresentation; calling them "rare" and charging a premium price for these moggies is deceitful. Please do your own due diligence and check references thoroughly. Being a "TICA Breeder" does not mean anything, TICA does not vet any breeders that submit information to their registry. Get your Ragdoll from a reputable breeder, not someone who knows the minimum about Ragdolls and either does not know or does not care that they are mis-marketing their cats...if they're lying about pedigree, what else are they lying about?

Edit:

The reason to go with the reputable breeder is because the main purpose of getting a Ragdoll is to get that sweet Ragdoll personality. IMO the color is secondary for a pet...but still important because color and conformation indicate that the breeder is attempting to better the breed, follow breed standards, eliminate weaknesses and genetic illnesses. That is the purpose of breeding to type: to match Ragdolls that have attributes that are the best of the breed.

Those seeking to make money from breeding don't care what the standards are and will breed whatever cats they have on hand. Even if they have HCM...if they even know if they have HCM...but did they even bother to test? Most likely not... Oops litter? Oh, that's fine, they can sell those...nobody will know because as long as one parent is registered, they can all be registered...and we'll just call those the "rare" ones...jack up the price because they're "rare"...nobody will know the difference. Cute cat? Sure. Overpriced and/or sick cat? Very likely.

Ragdoll Fancier's Club International (the people who determine Ragdoll standards) say: http://rfci.org/description-of-the-ragdoll/

The only Ragdolls that are accepted in the written Ragdoll standard in all major associations are blue-eyed pointed Ragdolls.

There are a minority of breeders who breed non-pointed, non-blue-eyed cats, often advertised as “solid, mink or sepia” Ragdolls. It is important to note that these cats have not been accepted by any major association, nor do they comply with the current written Breed Standard that describes the Ragdoll as a blue-eyed, pointed Breed. You will see advertisements as them being “rare”. The reason they are rare is because they are not accepted in the written Ragdoll breed standard and so reputable breeders will not have them in their breeding programs.  (Note: Please read here to see why to avoid breeders that breed mink, solid, or sepia cats: http://ragdollcatsunited.com/smf/index.php?topic=52.0)

The Cat Fancier's Association (a respected cat registry) says: http://cfa.org/Breeds/BreedsKthruR/Ragdoll.aspx

Ragdolls are large, laid-back, semi longhaired cats with captivating blue eyes. The Ragdoll is a pointed breed, which means that the body is lighter in color than the points (the face, legs, tail and ears). The Ragdoll cat is carefully bred to produce large affectionate animals in three patterns, two with white (mitted and bi-color) and one with no white (colorpoint). The ideal Ragdoll is a well balanced cat, with no extreme features. Altered males will usually top the scale at 15-20 pounds; females are proportionately smaller and usually weigh between 10-15 pounds at maturity. Ragdolls are slow-maturing, reaching full coat color at two years, and full size and weight at four.

Even TICA (also a cat registry) says: http://www.tica.org/en/cat-breeds/item/254-ragdoll-introduction

The Ragdoll's medium length, silky coat has a soft rabbit-like texture. There is little shedding of the coat except in the spring and fall. Its soft texture means it stays on top of surfaces and is easy to pick-up with a hand or damp cloth. All pointed Ragdolls have beautiful blue eyes and come in 3 patterns: colorpoint, bicolor, mitted. The Ragdoll color pallet consists of seal, blue, chocolate, lilac, cinnamon, fawn, red and cream along with the tortoiseshell and lynx (or tabby) variations. Colorpoint Ragdolls have classic markings like the Siamese with no white anywhere on the body; mitted Ragdolls have white feet in the front looking like mittens and white to the hock on the backlegs looking like boots along with a possible white blaze on the face; bi-color Ragdolls have more white extending higher up the legs than on the mitteds, splashes of white on the back, a white underside and an inverted white V on the face.

TICA also notes: http://www.tica.org/en/find-a-breeder/item/303-ragdoll-breeders

The breeders you find listed here are TICA members who have signed the TICA Code of Ethics.

TICA makes no representations or warranties with respect to the breeding or business practices of any of the persons listed. TICA strongly recommends that transactions with breeders be undertaken with the same caution and due diligence as one would devote to any important business matter.

Also note: not all blue eyed-pointed cats are Ragdolls. Know your breeder! Get what you pay for!
« Last Edit: August 18, 2019, 09:19:29 pm by Desi »
  • Desmond the Ragdoll, Duma the Savannah, and Baby Bobbie Dylan child of the mean streets, poetess and occasional musician.
I think it's fixed now
 
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Offline Desi

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Re: PSA: All Ragdolls are Blue Eyed, Pointed Cats
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2018, 01:23:16 am »
Some misinformed responses and answers:

Response> While mostly true, you can't always depend on temperament or coat composition. The Ragdoll breed, unlike something similar like the Birman, is still relatively new. As such, it hasn't "bred out" the inconsistencies yet.

For example, I have two certified Ragdolls from the same litter. One is a blue bicolor male which mostly typifies the breed. His sister is a blue mitted, but she has a definite cottony undercoat, and she's extremely temperamental, going so far as to growl and hiss at my other cats (especially her brother) and even unknown knocks at the door. She's only sweet to us, and other people once they've actually come inside. Neither enjoy being picked up, but she actively struggles and complains.

So it doesn't surprise me that some breeders are trying to introduce color varients. People seem to think all fluffy pointed cats with blue eyes are Ragdolls. It's a mistake in my opinion, because as long as this continues, the breed will continue to be inconsistent. I love my kitties, but had I known then what I know now, I probably would have gone with a pair of Birman instead.

Answer> It's a long stretch between breed inconsistencies and mismarked patterns, to breeders introducing unaccepted variants into the breed under false pretenses and against RFCI guidelines.

If you are dealing with a breeder who is actively striving to better the breed you are more likely to get a healthy, typical Ragdoll. If you buy a cat from someone breeding "Ragdolls" that may or may not be actual Ragdolls to make money, frankly you're lucky if you don't end up with a cat that is sick (HCM, for example).

The reason to go with the reputable breeder is because the main purpose of getting a Ragdoll is to get that sweet Ragdoll personality. IMO the color is secondary for a pet...but still important because color and conformation indicate that the breeder is attempting to better the breed, follow breed standards, eliminate weaknesses and genetic illnesses. That is the purpose of breeding to type: to match Ragdolls that have attributes that are the best of the breed. A Ragdoll may be mismarked for a number of reasons, for example if the breeder finds a cat that has a particular quality that they want to add to their line (maybe personality? ear setting? eye shape?) and sacrifices pattern conformity (maybe too much white in a bicolor or a blaze that is too big or odd shaped) in order to get that quality. This is called a breeding program (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Breeding_program), an indication of a good breeder.

Those seeking to make money from breeding don't care what the standards are and will breed whatever cats they have on hand. Even if they have HCM...if they even know if they have HCM...but did they even bother to test? Most likely not... Oops litter? Oh, that's fine, they can sell those...nobody will know because as long as one parent is registered, they can all be registered...and we'll just call those the "rare" ones...jack up the price because they're "rare"...nobody will know the difference. Cute cat? Sure. Overpriced and/or sick cat? Very likely.

...and because the registries depend on the breeder understanding the rules and entering truthful information they get to register their kittens as if they were Ragdolls so long as one (only 1) of the parents was registered as a Ragdoll, even if the parent isn't actually a Ragdoll itself...the purpose of a registry is to track cats, not to verify pedigrees, but you can check the pedigree yourself and see if you have an actual Ragdoll or a moggie that was bred from unaccepted variants, so long as the breeders were truthful with the information they entered into the registry (and if they weren't truthful, there's no real way to know).

Response> Solid coloured ragdolls are now starting to be accepted as part of the breed. I saw some really cute ones with definite ragdoll characteristics at my breeder.

Answer> Until the RFCI changes their definition, this is not true. "Starting to be accepted" (by unknowledgeable pet buyers) only means that there are more backyard breeders looking to cash in on people's lack of knowledge than genuine breeders looking to better the breed.

Any moggie can have "Ragdoll characteristics," lots of these at shelters.

Response> Well I dont know all about it but they are damn cute :D

Answer> I suppose that's valid, but then why not just get a Ragdoll-like moggie from a shelter? Why go to the trouble of looking for a pure bred Ragdoll?

The piece that people miss is that your chances of getting a healthy cat are higher with a random bred cat from a shelter...your chances of a healthy cat from a backyard breeder are quite low, since their motivation is making a quick buck; they don't really care if they're breeding genetically healthy cats.

Response> I think you may have misunderstood my sentiment. I really meant 'starting to become accepted' as 'starting to become accepted', I am fully aware that ragdolls, as they are right now, are born white and have blue eyes.  Matter of fact, I have two precious pure breds that have those characteristics and have been responsibly bred with regard for kidney and heart problems through genetic testing.  That breeder also has a couple of solids, who are very precious too and also bred responibly. Mind you, this is in the Netherlands

Answer> Anybody can breed whatever cat, anywhere...even responsibly...still doesn't make them Ragdolls. It makes them moggies that are Ragdoll-like, same as so many other moggies you find in shelters that were bred with random cats (and maybe one Ragdoll parent somewhere in the lineage). See my original post with quote from RCFI.

  • Desmond the Ragdoll, Duma the Savannah, and Baby Bobbie Dylan child of the mean streets, poetess and occasional musician.
I think it's fixed now
 
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Re: PSA: All Ragdolls are Blue Eyed, Pointed Cats
« Reply #1 on: June 21, 2018, 01:23:16 am »

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